Being his grandfather's son.

• Position: American Thought - Associate Justice Clarence Thomas - Interview

The following is an edited transcript of conversation with Associate Justice Clarence Thomas. Conducting the interview in his chambers at the Supreme Court in Washington, D.C., were Kaitlyn Buss, Daniel Burfiend, and Jillian Melchior, seniors from the Herbert H. Dow II Program in American Journalism and the History and Political Science Department at Hillsdale (Mich.) College. Also present were Hillsdale Pres. Larry Arnn and Vice Pres. Douglas Jeffrey.

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Q: Why did you decide to write My Grandfather's Son: A Memoir?

CT: I've met with young people from all over the country ... some with privileged backgrounds and [others] with less privileged backgrounds, and they all have tough problems, challenges, and uncertainties in their lives. Often, they think that I grew up wise and had a plan in life to get where I have gotten--that I had no doubts and uncertainties myself. Well, the truth is that I had plenty of uncertainties and doubts, and this book is my story. I was proud when my editor called me as the book was being finalized and said: "The great thing about this book is that it's not the usual Washington book. It's yours; you wrote it." In fact, I did write it, and my hope is that young people who read It will trod something in it they can identify with and learn from.

Q: I've noticed that you have a theme in your speeches about people who have influenced you, and now you're trying to influence others in a similar way. Can you talk a little about who influenced you?

CT: The first line in the book is, "I was nine years old when I met my father." That refers to my biological father, but my grandfather was my real father. I named the book My Grandfather's Son because that's who I am. My grandfather and my grandmother influenced me and made me what I am today. That's why I always take offense when I hear it said that Yale or some other institution is responsible. I was already fully formed by my grandparents. Whatever was poured into this vessel came from their way of life, and from my grandfather's independence, his insistence on self-sufficiency, his desire to think for himself even in the segregated South.

My father left when I was two, and up there on the wall you can see a photograph by Walker Evans of the Savannah neighborhood where my mother, my brother, and I lived in one room. It doesn't look like much of a neighborhood, does it? When I went to live with my grandfather, I was seven. His name was Myers Anderson, and it was a different way of life that he had worked hard to make possible. He built his house, a cinderblock house. He made the cinderblocks, and he was proud of that. It had a refrigerator, a deep freezer, a hot water heater--I had never seen any of these things in my life. It was wonderful, and then he taught me the connection between having these things and work. Everything he had, he showed me how to get it the honest way.

One of my grandfather's favorite sayings was, "Old Man Can't is dead; I helped bury him." I must have heard that a hundred times. Today, we've grown comfortable with programs and theories, whether it's affirmative action or something else. Centralized governments always love grand theories and five-year plans, but no government program could have done what my grandfather did for me and for others who needed help. It's the golden role--do unto others as you would have them do unto you. The golden rule can't operate through a government program; it can only work between people.

I was talking to my brother once--my brother died eight years ago very suddenly, which was really devastating--and we agreed that my grandfather was the greatest person we had ever known. Mind you, as young people, there came a time that we rejected him, but he told us the truth about life. He taught us everything we needed to know to five in this world, and it remained with us. Even when people ask about my judicial philosophy, I can honestly say, to the extent I have one, it comes from my grandfather.

Q: In the photo of your grandfather, he looks like a very serious man. What was he like personally?

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CT: Yes, he was serious, and he was tough. He wasn't a mean man, but he was a hard man. He lived a hard life, and he was hardened by it. His life was marked by segregation, by no education, by having no father, by having his mother die when he was nine and going to live with his grandmother who was a freed slave. In a recent book, the...